TheFlashGuy
Jun 22, 04:28 PM
To paraphrase - "It's just a giant iPad!"
Dougie H
Mar 25, 09:41 PM
I find it frustrating that Firemint continues to hype this game and talk innovation when the game does not even work as advertised today, supporting both original and second iPad's. Crash and burn. How about a news release on the improvements they will be making to stop the crashing rather than this pathetic self promoting fallacy.
iGav
Mar 9, 02:18 PM
So I don't think they did any modifications to the suspension.
I'd hazard a guess that they probably did� just because of the difference in preference in ride quality, European cars are naturally exceedingly firm� the same cars with sports suspension, excruciatingly so.
The Insignia's not a bad car by any means, the OPC/VXR concept looked particularly mean, especially in wagon form, but the rear of the hatchback looks a little odd to me, fussily unresolved with so many bad lines� but that is probably to be expected given it's World Car origins. It's wheelbase looks far too short as well.
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/opel-insignia-opc-sports-tourer-1.jpg
I agree. If you look at "small" cars these days, they really aren't that small. Of course, what made the Mini special was packaging, and I don't think we've seen a revolutionary new "package" since the Mini.
I'd suggest that the A2 was the last truly innovative car with regards to packaging, spaceframe, double-floor (like the A Class, but much better implemented) etc.
Something like the Smart is too compromised in achieving it's small footprint, and the IQ is as conventional as they come. As are cars like the Ka/500, i10 etc.
I think VW was on to something with their up! concept, (rear engined, 2 or 3 cylinder engine (I forget which), and a minimalist cabin) but then they decided the layout was too difficult to make work (read as too expensive, can't be bothered) and it's becoming a conventional FE/FWD hatch� when they could have launched the new people's car for the 21st century, with an innovative drivetrain and modular interior functionality, based on something like an iPad type device (which is what VW's new Hackney Cab concept looks to be implementing).
Chevy definitely has a lot of work to do to establish a brand presence in Europe - especially since Opel already covers so much territory with its lineup. Apart from niche vehicles like the Corvette, there isn't much of "American" Chevy that can make the transition to Europe. And in the long run,
I can't help but think GM would've been better repositioning Opel. They're making unnecessary (not to mention needlessly expensive) work for themselves with Chevy. It's a bit icy out isn't it? Is that the captain at the bar? ;)
Chevy can't rely on rebadged Korean cars.
They can't� especially when rival Korean cars are very, very good indeed, if still a little dull.
Damning with faint praise!
What can I say� it's ingrained. :p
In the context of this thread I am happy to see a Cruze diesel come to the US, and I think the Cruze will be an improvement over previous GM small cars,
It's considered more mid-size here if anything. In Holden form, right up until the C-Pillar it's a fine design, but like a lot of cars today, it's got bum trouble.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/21/2009-2010_Holden_JG_Cruze_CDX_sedan_02.jpg/800px-2009-2010_Holden_JG_Cruze_CDX_sedan_02.jpg
It is true that their biggest problem is coming up with a reason to buy it over other similarly anonymous cars.
I think that would be my issue, if I were thinking of dropping the �$�� on a new car, I'd be thinking to myself, is a new car so important to me as to stomach the depreciation that drops like an atom-bomb, or do I buy myself a new Golf?
And we never got to see it here.
And is it any wonder that Ford U.S. almost went the way of the muff?
if any car company has shown to have any knowledge about badge engineering/branding it's VW AG
Indeed, this alone would be a thread in itself wouldn't it. :p
believe it or not back in the 70ties Opel actually had a trendy, sporty and young reputation image
That'll be the Manta. :p
Vauxhall have never really had that image. It's no coincidence that in Cockney Rhyming Slang, that Vauxhall rhymes with Dull.
it's not exactly GM alone:
yes VW are really bland looking too, but opposed to many GM vehicles if you take the badge away you would be still able recognize that the vehicle is a VW ...
And you highlight exactly where many/most car manufacturers go wrong when it comes to developing a World Car and why they're seldom truly successful. BMW & Mercedes have been producing World Cars for decades haven't they, some would say successfully so. Why? Because they're completely & unapologetically Germanic.
seriously the new micra is bringing the bland back to the brand ..
True that� it looks older than the car it replaced. :eek:
at least hyundai finally realised that those names they were putting on their models weren't the brightest idea in 95% of all cases
The i10 has gotten rave reviews over here, frequently voted best city-urban-girls car or something� I heard that when a man drives one, his balls shrink and he assumes a pre-pubescent state. ;)
I'd hazard a guess that they probably did� just because of the difference in preference in ride quality, European cars are naturally exceedingly firm� the same cars with sports suspension, excruciatingly so.
The Insignia's not a bad car by any means, the OPC/VXR concept looked particularly mean, especially in wagon form, but the rear of the hatchback looks a little odd to me, fussily unresolved with so many bad lines� but that is probably to be expected given it's World Car origins. It's wheelbase looks far too short as well.
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/opel-insignia-opc-sports-tourer-1.jpg
I agree. If you look at "small" cars these days, they really aren't that small. Of course, what made the Mini special was packaging, and I don't think we've seen a revolutionary new "package" since the Mini.
I'd suggest that the A2 was the last truly innovative car with regards to packaging, spaceframe, double-floor (like the A Class, but much better implemented) etc.
Something like the Smart is too compromised in achieving it's small footprint, and the IQ is as conventional as they come. As are cars like the Ka/500, i10 etc.
I think VW was on to something with their up! concept, (rear engined, 2 or 3 cylinder engine (I forget which), and a minimalist cabin) but then they decided the layout was too difficult to make work (read as too expensive, can't be bothered) and it's becoming a conventional FE/FWD hatch� when they could have launched the new people's car for the 21st century, with an innovative drivetrain and modular interior functionality, based on something like an iPad type device (which is what VW's new Hackney Cab concept looks to be implementing).
Chevy definitely has a lot of work to do to establish a brand presence in Europe - especially since Opel already covers so much territory with its lineup. Apart from niche vehicles like the Corvette, there isn't much of "American" Chevy that can make the transition to Europe. And in the long run,
I can't help but think GM would've been better repositioning Opel. They're making unnecessary (not to mention needlessly expensive) work for themselves with Chevy. It's a bit icy out isn't it? Is that the captain at the bar? ;)
Chevy can't rely on rebadged Korean cars.
They can't� especially when rival Korean cars are very, very good indeed, if still a little dull.
Damning with faint praise!
What can I say� it's ingrained. :p
In the context of this thread I am happy to see a Cruze diesel come to the US, and I think the Cruze will be an improvement over previous GM small cars,
It's considered more mid-size here if anything. In Holden form, right up until the C-Pillar it's a fine design, but like a lot of cars today, it's got bum trouble.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/21/2009-2010_Holden_JG_Cruze_CDX_sedan_02.jpg/800px-2009-2010_Holden_JG_Cruze_CDX_sedan_02.jpg
It is true that their biggest problem is coming up with a reason to buy it over other similarly anonymous cars.
I think that would be my issue, if I were thinking of dropping the �$�� on a new car, I'd be thinking to myself, is a new car so important to me as to stomach the depreciation that drops like an atom-bomb, or do I buy myself a new Golf?
And we never got to see it here.
And is it any wonder that Ford U.S. almost went the way of the muff?
if any car company has shown to have any knowledge about badge engineering/branding it's VW AG
Indeed, this alone would be a thread in itself wouldn't it. :p
believe it or not back in the 70ties Opel actually had a trendy, sporty and young reputation image
That'll be the Manta. :p
Vauxhall have never really had that image. It's no coincidence that in Cockney Rhyming Slang, that Vauxhall rhymes with Dull.
it's not exactly GM alone:
yes VW are really bland looking too, but opposed to many GM vehicles if you take the badge away you would be still able recognize that the vehicle is a VW ...
And you highlight exactly where many/most car manufacturers go wrong when it comes to developing a World Car and why they're seldom truly successful. BMW & Mercedes have been producing World Cars for decades haven't they, some would say successfully so. Why? Because they're completely & unapologetically Germanic.
seriously the new micra is bringing the bland back to the brand ..
True that� it looks older than the car it replaced. :eek:
at least hyundai finally realised that those names they were putting on their models weren't the brightest idea in 95% of all cases
The i10 has gotten rave reviews over here, frequently voted best city-urban-girls car or something� I heard that when a man drives one, his balls shrink and he assumes a pre-pubescent state. ;)
puma1552
Jan 5, 09:39 PM
I am not to worried about that. I can do my own repairs, my last cars were major project cars. I have done pretty much everything (engine swaps, transmission swaps, etc.). Parts are not much more than I am used to, and since I won't be paying for labour does not really affect me.
Plus this guy seems like he really takes care of the car.
Sounds good then, but keep in mind the sheer downtime you will have, even if you do the repairs yourself.
FTR my E36 was a complete cream puff, one owner, full service records and regular maintenance--and it was the biggest piece of crap I ever had. I unloaded it needing $4500 worth of work, on top of the massive piles of money I had to throw into it over my four years.
Good luck, but you have been warned.;)
Plus this guy seems like he really takes care of the car.
Sounds good then, but keep in mind the sheer downtime you will have, even if you do the repairs yourself.
FTR my E36 was a complete cream puff, one owner, full service records and regular maintenance--and it was the biggest piece of crap I ever had. I unloaded it needing $4500 worth of work, on top of the massive piles of money I had to throw into it over my four years.
Good luck, but you have been warned.;)
celo48
Apr 3, 07:56 AM
I like the ad. At least it does not end like this.
"If you don't have an iPad, then you don't have an iPad."
"If you don't have an iPad, then you don't have an iPad."
Lord Blackadder
Feb 24, 07:18 PM
regarding japanese cars they somehow again managed to hit 2 homeruns in the stupid name department
the Mitsubishi iMiEV which in german is spoken out (translated) "iStink"
and the suzuki Kizashi which in austrian dialekt german sounds pretty close to " kiss...'lower backside' "
That is brilliant! :D
true that .. regarding german benchmark cars i would mention the Golf TDI, the Mercedes E250 Blu Efficiency CDI, the BMW M3 .. in their markets they are simply the best there is for different reasons:
the Golf TDI is defining a whole vehicle class for most of europe: "Golf Klasse", every new vehicle roughly the same size and hatchback layout gets compared to it
the E250 BE CDI: showing that a fuel saving vehicle doesn't need to be hideous and still can be a big saloon car driving from Barcelona to Stuttgart on a single tank
the M3: the sporty 4 door saloon car benchmark
The Golf GTD sounds like the perfect car to me: practical, efficient, yet with good performance. Sadly, we Americans will probably never get to buy one. :(
The M3 remains a great car, especially the 4-door versions.
It's got to be turbocharged for that amount of power and torque. There hasn't been a common rail non-turbo diesel made that I'm aware of.
I thought the same, the power and torque numbers are definitely turbodiesel territory, but I have been unable to find any official description of the engine (it's called the RA 420) that mentiones a turbo. VM. Motori's own web page (http://www.vmmotori.it/en/01/01/index.jsp) unhelpfully fails to even list the Cruze as an application or even the engine itself! Their automotive engine brochure (http://www.vmmotori.it/uploads/doc/1695.pdf) does list the RA 420 but doesn't label any of the engines as turbodiesels either.
EDIT: Automobile Magazine calls it a turbodiesel in their news article (http://rumors.automobilemag.com/diesel-rumor-2013-chevrolet-cruze-turbo-diesel-4-20279.html) about the diesel Cruze rumor, as does this (http://autoblog.com.ar/2011/02/lanzamiento-chevrolet-cruze-ampliacion-de-gama/) more descriptive Argentinian press release (in Spanish) so I have to assume it's just a case of VM Motori not being fully descriptive on their webpage. I hadn't heard of a common rail non-turbo diesel engine either, so I thought it a bit weird but without confirmation I had to assume non-turbo till proven otherwise.
the Mitsubishi iMiEV which in german is spoken out (translated) "iStink"
and the suzuki Kizashi which in austrian dialekt german sounds pretty close to " kiss...'lower backside' "
That is brilliant! :D
true that .. regarding german benchmark cars i would mention the Golf TDI, the Mercedes E250 Blu Efficiency CDI, the BMW M3 .. in their markets they are simply the best there is for different reasons:
the Golf TDI is defining a whole vehicle class for most of europe: "Golf Klasse", every new vehicle roughly the same size and hatchback layout gets compared to it
the E250 BE CDI: showing that a fuel saving vehicle doesn't need to be hideous and still can be a big saloon car driving from Barcelona to Stuttgart on a single tank
the M3: the sporty 4 door saloon car benchmark
The Golf GTD sounds like the perfect car to me: practical, efficient, yet with good performance. Sadly, we Americans will probably never get to buy one. :(
The M3 remains a great car, especially the 4-door versions.
It's got to be turbocharged for that amount of power and torque. There hasn't been a common rail non-turbo diesel made that I'm aware of.
I thought the same, the power and torque numbers are definitely turbodiesel territory, but I have been unable to find any official description of the engine (it's called the RA 420) that mentiones a turbo. VM. Motori's own web page (http://www.vmmotori.it/en/01/01/index.jsp) unhelpfully fails to even list the Cruze as an application or even the engine itself! Their automotive engine brochure (http://www.vmmotori.it/uploads/doc/1695.pdf) does list the RA 420 but doesn't label any of the engines as turbodiesels either.
EDIT: Automobile Magazine calls it a turbodiesel in their news article (http://rumors.automobilemag.com/diesel-rumor-2013-chevrolet-cruze-turbo-diesel-4-20279.html) about the diesel Cruze rumor, as does this (http://autoblog.com.ar/2011/02/lanzamiento-chevrolet-cruze-ampliacion-de-gama/) more descriptive Argentinian press release (in Spanish) so I have to assume it's just a case of VM Motori not being fully descriptive on their webpage. I hadn't heard of a common rail non-turbo diesel engine either, so I thought it a bit weird but without confirmation I had to assume non-turbo till proven otherwise.
redAPPLE
Nov 30, 08:50 AM
i just want to know if this will replace the airport express.
iphone3gs16gb
Jan 23, 12:21 AM
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5247/5249125771_40b962bf86_b.jpg
can anybody guess what year/model it is? :D
can anybody guess what year/model it is? :D
iMikeT
Aug 29, 09:25 AM
If the GPU is upgraded, I'll definitely get one.
weckart
Apr 11, 06:53 AM
That said, VW/Audi`s DSG semi auto`s are excellent.
Agreed and it has transformed my view of autos. I can't change as slickly as the DSG manages in my Audi. That being said, it still needs a bit of help coming into roundabouts or sharp bends and I miss having a biting point when stopping at traffic lights uphill. Fuel economy is as good as a manual, surprisingly enough.
Currently driving an auto Mercedes, whilst mine is in the workshop. Nowhere near as slick.
Agreed and it has transformed my view of autos. I can't change as slickly as the DSG manages in my Audi. That being said, it still needs a bit of help coming into roundabouts or sharp bends and I miss having a biting point when stopping at traffic lights uphill. Fuel economy is as good as a manual, surprisingly enough.
Currently driving an auto Mercedes, whilst mine is in the workshop. Nowhere near as slick.
MacSA
Oct 24, 04:01 AM
No the E207WFP 20 is 1650x1050.
I advocate the 2007FP 20 1600x1200 for only $359.20 (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-4687). That extra 150 verticle pixels is very helpful.
Dell really are fleecing their none US customers:
20" 2007FP: �311
24" 2407WFP: �566
20" 2007WFP: �401
30" 3007WFP: �1,365
People here are always raving about Dells low prices here, but I really dont think they're that cheap at all (in the UK) - unless you buy something with very old hardware that is.
I advocate the 2007FP 20 1600x1200 for only $359.20 (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-4687). That extra 150 verticle pixels is very helpful.
Dell really are fleecing their none US customers:
20" 2007FP: �311
24" 2407WFP: �566
20" 2007WFP: �401
30" 3007WFP: �1,365
People here are always raving about Dells low prices here, but I really dont think they're that cheap at all (in the UK) - unless you buy something with very old hardware that is.
wordoflife
Feb 19, 09:44 PM
crapy iphone pics
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ObeyHK/photo.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ObeyHK/photo-1.jpg
Beautiful view!
Holy crap! That is a nice view!
I'm jealous!
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ObeyHK/photo.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ObeyHK/photo-1.jpg
Beautiful view!
Holy crap! That is a nice view!
I'm jealous!
miloblithe
Sep 6, 09:30 AM
Comparing the prices of the new iMacs and the Mac mini is absurd. The killer
feature of the mini is its form factor. Wake me up when you can use an iMac
as a file/download server placed in your desk drawer.
Fair enough, but what about those of us who want to buy a general purpose computer? (Probably most people)
feature of the mini is its form factor. Wake me up when you can use an iMac
as a file/download server placed in your desk drawer.
Fair enough, but what about those of us who want to buy a general purpose computer? (Probably most people)
Akme
Mar 31, 12:23 PM
Anyone else having their menu bar go black regularly? Have to switch into Launchpad (or similar) to get it back to normal. It's often accompanied by the fan spinning up, so I'm assuming it's some sort of issue related to graphics switching/drivers.
Cybix
Aug 24, 07:26 PM
nice one... was looking to buy a mini to 'integrate' into my CAR... might wait now, then pick up a core solo intel for cheap! hopefully....
dmaxdmax
Nov 28, 05:09 PM
'Course, if Microsoft could, hypothetically, stop being such an evil company, I'd certainly overlook their shady past and could even, Jobs forbid!, use some of their products (provided they'd be up to my typical Mac User's standards :rolleyes: ). :D
"Jobs forbid" - funny
Yes, their EQ (Evil Quotient) may change over time as might their global strategy. We won't know until we know, ya know?
If in 1960 you told me the day would come when IBM wouldn't make a ton of money leasing card sorters I'd have been sceptical. (many called them evil for refusing to sell card readers to companies while charging the fair market value many times over on long-term leases) If in 1990 I had told you the day would come when IBM wouldn't be in the PC business you might have been sceptical. I, a dyed in the wool Apple fan, wouldn't have predicted Apple's success 10 years ago. MS has the money and worker-bee brains to stay in any game they choose to play. They should be ashamed of the Zune and I don't understand why they rushed it to market but I don't think it's a slam-dunk that it, and they, are doomed for the trashbin of corporate history.
I wouldn't mind being wrong in the least.
"Jobs forbid" - funny
Yes, their EQ (Evil Quotient) may change over time as might their global strategy. We won't know until we know, ya know?
If in 1960 you told me the day would come when IBM wouldn't make a ton of money leasing card sorters I'd have been sceptical. (many called them evil for refusing to sell card readers to companies while charging the fair market value many times over on long-term leases) If in 1990 I had told you the day would come when IBM wouldn't be in the PC business you might have been sceptical. I, a dyed in the wool Apple fan, wouldn't have predicted Apple's success 10 years ago. MS has the money and worker-bee brains to stay in any game they choose to play. They should be ashamed of the Zune and I don't understand why they rushed it to market but I don't think it's a slam-dunk that it, and they, are doomed for the trashbin of corporate history.
I wouldn't mind being wrong in the least.
MickyJ10
Sep 14, 06:25 PM
I've had no trouble with my phone. I'd recommend it to anyone. But CR will have a credibility issue if it backs down. If I were CR I'd not back down either.
maclaptop
Apr 21, 12:29 PM
One of the many advantages of my iPhone 4 tracking me, is that I have big brother watching me. I'm never alone.
The only problem is my stupid Android phone can't do the same.
I have an appointment with Apple next week, I'm giving them the keys to my house, cars, and all my tax returns, stock certificates and investment portfolio. They promise to do every thing for less than 70% of my annual income. A great deal.
I'm in good hands with Apple, not a worry in the world. I'm now an official Apple fanboy. Living in the walled garden all I have to do is be an Apple drone :)
Woo Hoo life is sweet.
The only problem is my stupid Android phone can't do the same.
I have an appointment with Apple next week, I'm giving them the keys to my house, cars, and all my tax returns, stock certificates and investment portfolio. They promise to do every thing for less than 70% of my annual income. A great deal.
I'm in good hands with Apple, not a worry in the world. I'm now an official Apple fanboy. Living in the walled garden all I have to do is be an Apple drone :)
Woo Hoo life is sweet.
MacSA
Oct 24, 04:01 AM
No the E207WFP 20 is 1650x1050.
I advocate the 2007FP 20 1600x1200 for only $359.20 (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-4687). That extra 150 verticle pixels is very helpful.
Dell really are fleecing their none US customers:
20" 2007FP: �311
24" 2407WFP: �566
20" 2007WFP: �401
30" 3007WFP: �1,365
People here are always raving about Dells low prices here, but I really dont think they're that cheap at all (in the UK) - unless you buy something with very old hardware that is.
I advocate the 2007FP 20 1600x1200 for only $359.20 (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-4687). That extra 150 verticle pixels is very helpful.
Dell really are fleecing their none US customers:
20" 2007FP: �311
24" 2407WFP: �566
20" 2007WFP: �401
30" 3007WFP: �1,365
People here are always raving about Dells low prices here, but I really dont think they're that cheap at all (in the UK) - unless you buy something with very old hardware that is.
cleanup
Nov 23, 10:06 PM
http://att.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=261567&stc=1&d=1290568599
X-rays and casting. It counts as a purchase.
Psht. I can get that up here for free.
X-rays and casting. It counts as a purchase.
Psht. I can get that up here for free.
torn
Sep 24, 08:33 AM
As a follow-up on the GripVue, note the notch to the right of the charging port. That's the unobstructed speaker...
http://www.belkin.com/images/product/F8Z657-C01_RND/FUL1_F8Z657-C01_RND.jpg
Also, note the colors on the "Tint" versions (Black, Clear (shown above), Royal Purple, Night Sky, and Taro). It's odd that the bright colors that Best Buy has (besides Night Sky) are not shown. They also have a "Metallic" line (Black, White, and Taro).
I've been waiting so long for this case :( Does anyone know when they're gonna release it?
http://www.belkin.com/images/product/F8Z657-C01_RND/FUL1_F8Z657-C01_RND.jpg
Also, note the colors on the "Tint" versions (Black, Clear (shown above), Royal Purple, Night Sky, and Taro). It's odd that the bright colors that Best Buy has (besides Night Sky) are not shown. They also have a "Metallic" line (Black, White, and Taro).
I've been waiting so long for this case :( Does anyone know when they're gonna release it?
Brinkman
Sep 14, 09:49 AM
Antenna gate was blown out of proportion :rolleyes:
It really was a non issue.
However I do enjoy my free case :)
It really was a non issue.
However I do enjoy my free case :)
trekkie604
Feb 19, 08:01 PM
Hasn't changed too much this time around:
http://link.trekcubed.com/trekmb_Feb2011_s.jpg (http://link.trekcubed.com/trekmb_Feb2011.jpg)
http://link.trekcubed.com/trekmb_Feb2011_s.jpg (http://link.trekcubed.com/trekmb_Feb2011.jpg)
(marc)
Mar 20, 08:24 AM
I actually think having troops is better. "Firing missles and bombing" from great distances has a "disconnect" between people. When you have actual people fighting and even dying alongside you, both the citizens and the warriors appreciated it more and form more of a bond between people and cultures. It builds a "comraderee" of sorts and helps secure a pschological future between peoples....whereas, in this case, perhaps the only interaction we really have with Lybians is that the generals and politicians might go to meetings. Something the masses never experience for themselves.
After something like this is over without them actually "enduring victory and suffering" with Westerners hugging them, many Lybians will still think...oh yeah, those are the infidels that helped us get Quadafi with their big guns. :p
And even in the eyes of the opposition, it can have a negative effect in that you don't see them face to face when you kill them. It can be seen as a sign of "weakness" and "chickeness". This is what happened with Clinton shooting tomahawks at Bin Laden and then walking away brushing his hands. When you look in their eyes and shoot them, they know you mean business and respect and fear you as a warrior. Then they might think twice before they try to blow up your buildings when you're not looking. ;)
The jets and rockets are there to prevent Gaddafi from killing civilians, not to prevent Gaddafi from winning.
After something like this is over without them actually "enduring victory and suffering" with Westerners hugging them, many Lybians will still think...oh yeah, those are the infidels that helped us get Quadafi with their big guns. :p
And even in the eyes of the opposition, it can have a negative effect in that you don't see them face to face when you kill them. It can be seen as a sign of "weakness" and "chickeness". This is what happened with Clinton shooting tomahawks at Bin Laden and then walking away brushing his hands. When you look in their eyes and shoot them, they know you mean business and respect and fear you as a warrior. Then they might think twice before they try to blow up your buildings when you're not looking. ;)
The jets and rockets are there to prevent Gaddafi from killing civilians, not to prevent Gaddafi from winning.
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